By Robin Sam
L Nirmal Nathan is an educationist based in Trichy, Tamil Nadu. He has an MBA in HR from XLRI. He has headed HR teams both in India and in Saudi Arabia. He is the director of Santa Maria, a Christian school in Trichy. By his own admission, he has known Pastor V Victor Gnanaraj for close to two decades. Although Nathan and Gnanaraj don’t see eye to eye on various doctrinal issues, the former says he respects the ageing pastor for his dignified behaviour and personal testimony. Nathan has been at the forefront of the raging debate over the cause célèbre. After he came to know about the meeting, he researched Kirby De Lanerolle and his teachings. He blanched when he came to know the Sri Lankan preacher is a cultist who believes in immortality on earth and breatheranism, but before long he decided to confront the challenge head-on. The Christian Messenger spoke to Nirmal Nathan on April 23. Excerpts from the interview:
How well do you know Pastor Victor Gnanaraj?
I have known him since December 1995. I’ve had a good regard for him. He’s dignified and generally well-behaved. He’s had a good personal testimony in Trichy. I’ve met with him several times and interacted with him on several occasions for various ministry purposes.
Have you had any inkling earlier that he was veering towards cultist teachings?
Yes, when I first attended his pre-Christmas morning service on 24th December 1995, I was startled to see a member violently laughing during the worship. Later, I learnt it as ‘Laughing in the Spirit.’ During the same service, I heard Gnanaraj preach. “Tonight, in the Christmas service, the Word of God is going to form in your stomachs (of the attendees) as it happened in the case of Mary, and…’ I freaked out. That was also the last time I attended his church.
Thereafter, whenever I met with him he would give me video CDs. One particular VCD had a recording of purported gold dust falling during the service in his church. Later, during our meetings he would tell me that he had visited heaven. During one of his supposed visits to heaven, he said he saw a huge storeroom where human body parts were kept. He was told, he said, that these were to be carried by the angels to those who were sick and needed total healing. He would also tell me that he was being frequented by angels and that he was going beyond Bible revelation. Another VCD he gave me contained testimonies of miracles that we normally witness in healing meetings. There was also this person, a member of Gnanaraj’s church who told me that once when he had a severe bout of earache, the pastor visited him in a vision and healed him – not the Lord, mind you, but the pastor appearing in a vision to heal. Several such accounts have scared the day lights out of people in Trichy for many years.
Also read – Interview: I need money for my TV programmes: Victor Gnanaraj
What are the other contentious issues in his sermons?
I have not listened to his sermons from then on…
What did you do when you heard Kirby De Lanerolle was going to preach at Victor Gnanaraj’s church?
I challenged the pastors in Trichy to stop this nonsense or at least prevent their congregation from attending the meetings. I provided the pastors with what had emerged out of my research on Kirby’s teachings. They were completely erroneous and against Biblical truths. In all my emails to pastors, I marked a copy to Pastor Gnanaraj.
What was his reaction?
Well, he never cared to reply to me personally. Another young man who forwarded my emails to him got replies from him. I was also copied on them. In those replies, Gnanaraj says like Apostle Paul he was also transcending ‘sense knowledge’ to a new level of ‘spirit knowledge’. Such things, he says was beyond the purview of educationists like me. He defends ‘breatharanism and says he himself is turning younger now. He also defends ‘holy laughter’ by saying he and his wife frequently engage in ‘laughing in the spirit’. He also issues soft threats to those who oppose Kirby’s meetings. He says they will face the wrath of God just as Korah did in the Old Testament days. During the April 12 service at his church, he publicly placed a curse on me saying I am destined for the ‘lake of fire’ for opposing his efforts and Kirby’s meetings. I am told Pastor Gnanaraj frequently curses people who are against him in his sermons.
You say Pastor Gnanaraj has cancelled paid registration to the meetings and made them free. Why would he do that?
Yes, he has cancelled the registration fee (Rs.1,000 per person). Not a single person from his church volunteered to register for the meeting till April 18. He must have been embarrassed after I asked him why Kirby would registration fee since he can make cash appear in people’s pockets and make gold dust fall on the congregation anyway. During the last Sunday service, he said: “Last week, I saw that many of you had dropped only 10 rupee notes in the offerings. It looks like you are all suffering from a financial crisis. Hence, I am ordering a financial release by cancelling the registration fee for Kirby’s meetings in Zion Faith Tabernacle.”
The efforts of Grace & Truth Coalition in raising a red flag first over Kirby’s meetings, The Christian Messenger in its sustained media coverage on the issue and our own efforts here locally in Trichy have made a major impact in the church in Trichy and in his own congregation.
Are his own church members aware of the danger that lies behind the cultist preacher’s meetings?
Yes. I believe that’s why last Saturday someone from Kirby’s team flew into Trichy from Sri Lanka to defend Kirby’s ministry before ZFT members.
To your knowledge, has any senior church pastor or ministry leader spoken to Victor Gnanaraj and tried to dissuade him from hosting the meetings?
That’s the problem with pastors. No one dares to bell the cat. They’d rather keep a dignified silence and politely wish each other instead of gently guiding the errant ones out of their error. That’s why I am saying the pastors who remain silent spectators are also partners in the crime against the church. Only a few people like Bro. Stanley of Blessing Youth Mission, Bro. Augustine Jebakumar of GEMS, Bro. Duke Jeyaraj and Bro Augustin Balan take up the fight against the corruption within the church. And, generally pastors don’t like evangelists thundering against them and parachurch leaders who misuse their ministry position.
Besides Victor Gnanaraj, who are the decision makers in his church?
Nobody else, I learn. Others are simply told to execute and not participate in the decision-making process. Pastor Gnanaraj has even terminated a monthly prayer meeting of ZFT elders saying, ‘prayers cause problems.’ He has also put a stop to evangelism efforts of the church saying, ‘I cannot put up additional floor space for new believers who would come in.’
Despite knowing about Kirby’s position on doctrinal issues, why do you think VG decided to bring him down to Tamil Nadu?
Pr. VG is well-known for his penchant for miracles, visitations, new interpretations and flashy stuff like these. It was only a matter of time before the truth about his doctrinal leanings came out in the public. Further, his emails show that he himself believes in Kirby’s doctrine of youth (and perhaps, even, immortality) and has begun experiment with it. He claims he wanted to personally listen to Kirby and assess him. If that were the real intent, he could have listened to Kirby’s messages on Youtube. So, it is clear that VG is not looking at assessing Kirby but he wants to provide a popular forum to project Kirby in India through his church and sponsored programmes on TV channels.
VG seems to be unapologetic about his decision to host Kirby. What should the church do now?
Pray that the Lord grants grace and mercy to them so they realize their errors and correct themselves. I sincerely hope the church resists such new-age fads. The church should warn their congregations against such strange teachings. The church must stop preaching and begin teaching the Word of God so their members mature in Christ and keep their heart, mind and souls safe and sound.
What do you think should the Body of Christ do to prevent a repeat of such things in future?
Kirby is only one of hundreds of problems facing the church. There are more people like him in our own State. P C J Geoffrey who claims fire anointing, Jesudian Silvester of ‘The Father’s House’ church, the list goes on. They are all on the same league as Kirby believing in breatharianism, holy laughter, moneyfestations, immortality and the like. Then there are these flashy sons of popular pastors who come out with audio and video concerts and albums. The Church is in fact in a deep slumber, not realizing that it is slowly regressing. More and more pastors are getting into a ‘routine’ ministry and take things for granted. We don’t see many of them attending training sessions, unless they are given incentives. It is about time pastors realized that they will be called to account for their unbiblical decisions and actions that will impair and damage the church. We need to pray for our pastors and ministry teams so that they would spend quality time with the Lord. Christian media should practice effective Christian journalism and do the watchman work vigorously.
Have you read VG’s book, ‘Heaven’s Intercept’?
No. I don’t read any of his books or listen to his messages. Why should I fall a prey to his wrong doctrine when there are true Gospel messages available everywhere?
Are you planning to attend the meeting and challenge Kirby’s erroneous teachings?
No. If I do that, Pr VG will be quick to capitalize on that and say even critics attended the meetings. Jesus has Himself said not to throw pearls before pigs. I am not worried about the ZFT church members because people get the leader they deserve. I am fighting for the believers in other churches who are targeted by such trap setters.
